I really enjoy Zwift and it has revolutionized indoor riding. I have some topics to throw out there for discussion and wish list for changes.
You should not get any climbing elevation toward the concept bike, if you are on a workout ride. I see riders on AdZ doing a workout all the time. Why? Some have told me that it’s an easy way to gain climbing.
No fastest segment times nor special leader jersey in game, if no heart rate.
Wish there was a separate world for workout rides. It can be a distraction when I’m doing an interval workout and people are drafting me. Seems like you also get a downhill advantage on a workout.
Wish you could make turns right up to the intersection. I don’t like having to reverse course for some distance, just to turn-a-round again, so I can make a turn that I missed.
Would like to turn off the way the camera zooms out when you approach/finish a segment. Like the top of Box Hill, Radio Tower and AdZ.
I woud disagree with #1 , climbing in workout mode is no different than in a normal ride, Zwift calculate speed based on power so Z2 in workout mode will have you going at the same speed as Z2 in non workout mode.
Why do you need HR for sprint or any Jersey?
In workout mode your speed mimics the gradient of of a climb, but you feel no change is resistance. You can turn off erg mode and just spin you way up AdZ. Much easier than dealing with the elevation resistance for an hour. I know someone who did an over/under workout up AdZ and their segment time was ~46 minutes. About 10 minutes faster than their fastest time in normal mode.
I‘m just skeptical of riders with no hr. I see riders climbing the epic KOM putting out 400 watts all the way with no hr. They should bein the next TdF
I have climbed AdZ in workout mode and regular and it’s definitely not the same experience.
The experience would certainly be different. In ERG mode you are controlled by a program producing watts at a prescribed rate with no regard for the terrain. In sim mode you are being controlled by the gradient, quite the opposite experience.
My point is not that the experience is the same, my point is that your legs produce the proper amount of power to get up the hill in that amount of time, even if it is erg mode. With that in mind you must give credit for the elevation gain.
Your friend that did an over under workout up AdZ… if he had done that same workout producing the same power in sim mode wouldn’t you agree that he would get up the hill in the same amount of time as when the trainer was controlled by erg mode? If he was 10 minutes slower in sim mode then he pushed the pedals with less power, simple as that. The workout pushed him harder.
How do you know how much power others are putting out with out HR? Zwift displays live w/kg data but I dont even know where to go to see their weight live while riding. Then I would need to calculate the raw watts. I know there are a ton of people who can produce in excess of 4 w/kg and even quite a few in the 5 w/kg range for an hour. They are not 80kg riders making 400 W though, more like 65kg @ 5w/kg = 325W.
Lastly remember that Zwift has a giant pool of talent from around the entire world. People often forget this. People often forget that there quite a few pro cyclists that use Zwift. There are many Zwifters with a 400W FTP. You cannot compare it to your locals on Strava or from your region that ride outside. It is world wide on Zwift. That is a very big pool of talent to compare to. I honestly expect that every climb segment will have a KOM in the 5.4 w/kg range (or higher) and every sprint segment will be taken by someone who can hold 1200W. There really exists that talent on Zwift.
Lastly yes people cheat. In Zwift and everything else in life. I dont worry about it too much. If I spent my time chasing down those that dont use HR monitors, have fake data, etc I would have no time left to enjoy Zwift.
I’ve ‘watched’ riders who put out 400 watts steadily, with no wavering. Definitely sketchy. I think the OP wants to have the HR so that, if nothing else, you can see if the HR at least reasonably matches the power output.
Excellent points and valid feedback!
I think you are missing my point on workouts and climbing. You can do a workout in erg mode or not in erg mode.
I think… my opinion only…in erg mode you feel the resistance from the required watts for that interval, but no gradient. You just go slower than if you were on a flat road. Not the same as climbing in sim mode. Sometimes in erg workout mode you are resting in between hard efforts and the watts are low like 120. If this happens while on a 12% gradient you feel no resistance from the gradient and spin easy up the climb.
If you turn erg off while in work out mode the only resistance you would feel on a climb would be your gear selection. No resistance from the gradient. Again, you just move slower, but no resistance from the gradient.
Moving slowly up a climb with no gradient resistance is much different than sim mode. You would not be putting out the same watts to get up the climb.
I have had people admit that they do workouts up the Alpe as an easy way to get the concept bike.
I do see pro tour riders on Zwift and their Strava as well. I find it funny when some riders that I know and ride with have much faster segment times than the Pro’s. I did a group ride last week and the rider with the fastest time was on rollers and said their data was way off from their actual ability. This happens a lot. Just a short coming of the platform and not a deal breaker for me at all. I accept that the data is not always accurate and just have fun.
Thanks for the feedback!!
Doing a workout Min erg mode, though, is kind of the whole point: do the specified watts for the specified period of time. If a rider still had to deal with the steep gradient of sim mode during the recovery potion of the workout that would be rather pointless.
I won’t disagree with you that this can make the Alpe ‘easier’, but the rider’s speed also drops accordingly so it’s not like they are getting any extra vertical distance than they would if they had the gearing to put out the low watts on a steep climb.
Yes you wont feel the resistance that is correct, but you will also slow down to 1km/h, the same will happen if you change your gears to 30 front and 34 on the back in sim mode.
I do a lot of workouts on climbs because of the XP rewards. When you aim for the tron you do everything on a climb, so if you have to do 2 hour Z2 then you pick a climb, but to keep you in the zone you use workout mode.
if you are faster in workout mode then you have a very hard workout with lost of Z5 and it also show that you can’t really pace your self in sim mode.
If you want to break the hour on the Alpe you can make a workout that will keep you at 3.2w/kg or you can ride sim and use your gears and keep it at 3.2w/kg.
what about a classic trainer with a powertap wheel. It does not change resistance up the climb?
Another great way to think of it. Yes at 120W it feels easy with no resistance but you are moving dreadfully slow. Just like having a very very easy climbing gear out doors that allowed you to still spin 90rpm at 1mph.
Similarly should all zPower riders be excluded? That is known to be the least accurate method of measuring power. Perhaps some of these are the 400W steady state riders? Pushing 250 but zPower says it is 400?
I dont fan view too often but you are right I can see power that way. I will take a look.