So is that because it changed their seed score?
I thought seed score was based on 5 min power.
Perhaps it is 5 min W/KG.
I agree - I wonât teleport or sit on the side of the road, since I want to achieve the upgrades in the SPIRIT it was intended - do the actual work.
At least thatâs my interpretation of the requirements - do the work.
If someone decides that their interpretation is to not do the actual work, thatâs completely on them, and I would not want to be associated with that person if I knew how they did it.
Ooo thatâs super useful
Seed was originally 30s and 10min but was clearly too biased to 30s. The change they made put it more across the curve but I wasnât sure whaf
This seems too simplistic for ZRS but maybe they really simplified it âŚ
The numbers coming out make sense thoughâŚ
Appreciate you.
Itâs an interesting question, what is/would be violating the TOS. Just popped out to check it, and the harassment clauses are:
You canât:
i.Engage in any harassing, threatening, intimidating, predatory or stalking conduct;
And you canât post content that:
ii.Is unlawful, libelous, defamatory, obscene, pornographic, indecent, lewd, suggestive, harassing, threatening, invasive of privacy or publicity rights, abusive, inflammatory or fraudulent;
HoweverâŚ
You also canât
vii.Use our Platform other than for its intended purpose AND in any manner that could interfere with, disrupt, negatively affect or inhibit other users from fully enjoying our Platform or that could damage, disable, overburden or impair the functioning of our Platform in any manner;
(Thatâs my bolding, and my all-capsing of the âANDâ)
SoâŚZwift is at this point imo well-known for having a terribly ineffective harassment policy and practice. Women get cyber-stalked by creeps on this platform all the time, for example, and end up having to change their usernames multiple times to avoid itâŚwhich doesnât work. So thatâs already a problem, of vagueness in particular (setting aside their ineffectiveness in upholding the policy).
The question here is what constitutes harassment. If someone else isâin someoneâs opinionâthemselves violating the TOS, is it harassment to point them out to others? For example:
Rider X is teleporting to the top of the Alpe to descend and upgrade their bike. Rider Y sees this as A) counter to the intended use of the system, and B) negatively affecting Yâs enjoyment of the platform. So in the opinion of Y, Rider X is violating the TOS clause above.
So what can Rider Y do that would be harassment, and what would not be? Just mentioning that people are doing what X is doing doesnât sound like harassment to me. Naming individual riders is closerâbut if those riders are in fact violating TOS, is calling them out âharassmentâ? Is just naming the teams that are doing this harassment? And not even naming teams explicitly, just hinting at names of teams?
Iâm not sure that a small number of instances of pointing to people violating TOS counts as harassment. Iâm not sure it doesnât, given Zwiftâs vagueness. But Iâm not sure it does, either. It seems reasonable that the âDescendersâ are in fact not using the system as the programmers intended, which triggers that third clause above. That at least opens a door for discussion. Question is can the actual TOS violators be vaguely pointed to?
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Descenders.
I like that term.
Did you make that up Tom?
What should we call the TT bike folks sitting on the roadside?
I did make that up, but you can use it. Just donât put it on t-shirts without asking 
The TT folksâŚSquatters?
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ohh man. The rabbit hole.
Ultimately, which Iâve mentioned previously, this is a Zwift issue. Zwift loves everyone to have a great time and at the same time Zwift wants this utopia of no rules. The community is large enough that maybe there should be some written rules in place. Or better yet, Zwift could implement limitations on the game mechanics themselves? If you are stopped on the side of the road you donât get credit for riding? Seems easy enough. How many times a ride does someone need to teleport to a friend? Once, twice, three times? Put a limitation that when you go to teleport for the 2nd time the game locks you out.
Iâve done my fair share of complaining to Zwift about actual cheating and in all cases, Zwift came back with a âwell maybe the person didnât intend to cheat? Letâs give them the benefit of the doubt at least 15 more times then maybe we will look into it.â
I have seen that though without rules the community can become kind of toxic because Zwift is using the community to do the policing and thatâs not really fair for anyone.
Edit to add Code of Conduct which links from the TOS
Zwift does not tolerate cyber-bullying, hate speech, harassment, threats, or personal attacksâwithin the game or anywhere else. If you are on the receiving end of this kind of behavior or see it happening to someone else, do not hesitate to flag it via zwift.com/contact-us, or by using the Companion App. Check out this article for more info.
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Squatters, Descenders, Sandbaggers , Oh my !!
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So should Zwift be adding a chairlift on the Alpe then? You canât teleport but you need to sit on a chairlift for 15 minutes to get the top before âDescendingâ
I do think users here are unanimous in thinking Zwift should be fixing this. Problem is that we keep trying to find ways to nudge/sway/force their hands into actually doing something aboutâŚthings.
The folks who run this forum donât like naming specific names, and that seems to be the one hard line that is drawn. But there have been teams named here in the past for other irritating behaviorsâpeople posting here to complain about certain teams spamming Club invites, for example. It hasnât seemed like harassment to name those teams publicly. Part of harassment or bullying is also repetitionâis someone coming here to slam a club spamming team every day, or posting once for helpâŚand again when it happens again?
I donât remember specific team names being mentioned in this thread (donât have perfect recall of allâŚ641 postsâŚthough). But Iâll admit I only have a vague idea of who these teams being referred to are. So my take on it hasnât been that itâs been harassment. Specific team names, repeatedly mentioned, would be where Iâd be drawing a line. But ymmv to some degree on that. Iâm sure the people actually on those teams have been feeling harassed since they were even hinted at
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Nah, just donât allow the descent to count for any upgrades unless you also did the climb. Lots of people are climbing on one bike and descending on the other. Itâs doing the work of the climb that is at the crux. (Just donât do it on a Crux)
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Your first paragraph.
My love/hate relationship with Zwift. Things happen at Zwift HQ at a glacial pace. A concern I have is that Zwift canât control or implement control with what is happening in the game as it is. Now they are going to open things up for outside rides? I can see it now. People going on road trips with their Garmin in their car logging giant Zwift mileage, lol.
Part of the point of my strongly worded posts earlier. Thereâs a lot of âcheaterâ talk but I donât think thereâs enough âZwift what are you doing about thisâ type talk.
Sometimes I feel that Zwift came out last year. Despite being over 10 years old Zwift still gives out âwe are just a baby start up and donât really know what we are doingâ vibes
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I just donât think anyone from Zwift is going to wade into a discussion like this anyway, not at this point, and not for the last 300 posts. I suspect theyâve decided to let this thread be a complaint collector. And I think thatâs what leads people to think that discussing the Descenders and Squatters is a separate issue from âWWZDâ (What Will Zwift Do)âthinking that maybe some glancing public shaming will either move the needle here, or make others think twice about it. 
No idea if it will be effective. The sort of people who actually thought to collect their teams together to break the system like this (as opposed to just doing it yourself in a back alley somewhere) likely donât care if others think poorly of them.
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Pro races and Zwift Games were on neutralized bikes.
Expect more of that from race organizers.
I think a problem you gave is that terms such as bullying and harassment are subjective terms.
If I went onto the strava feed of someone whoâs been using teleporting and commented âLoving those vertical ascents!â would that count as harassment? Iâd say not, even though itâs obviously taking the p*ss, albeit with âplausible deniabilityâ. But others might take a different view.
And yesterday, someone with whom Iâm connected on Zwift was using me to teleport to, without asking me, as I was doing hill reps (and upgrading the Aethos). Would I be more justified in âverbalsâ in such circumstances? I could only nod in appreciation of the move tbh. Itâs not what Iâd do, but if youâre going to game the system, you might as well game it as thoroughly as you can!
That is where the block can be used if you want to.
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Or block and report
Thanks. Iâm not bothered really. I just quoted it as an example of where the boundary between âharassmentâ and âfair commentâ might vary vs consensual teleporting activities.