i’ve seen a couple. at least i think they are ebikes. they are very obvious to spot though, whatever they are
I would support going to the second option and intend to go for a second power source only because I want the second power data as a verification of my now “veteran” Kickr Bike.
As for the first, I’d go a different way, Zpower devices still able to use Zwift but don’t show on leaderboards and they aren’t able to draft or be drafted. So they don’t influence group rides or pace of other riders. At the moment they can wreck group rides or even robopacer groups with their unrealistic pace. It’s bad when “Mr ZPower” (that’s what the regulars call him) arrives at Constance group with 5.0w/kg+ steady power. If you are at a lower power robopacer group you probably don’t care and may even think it’s a great laugh to stir up others, but it’s wrong.
Something else that has been happening is riders setting up their own pace bots. That also needs to be stopped. It’s against the terms of service so there is no excuse.
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If an e bike were to be used in a scenario where dual power was required, wouldn’t the difference between say power pedals and the trainer expose it without having to guess?
I just can’t imagine the future of e racing without dual recording and Zwift should get on with it.
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The easiest way to cheat, and it’s hard to detect if the rider isn’t greedy!
I find this guy hilarious because he clearly isn’t thinking through what he’s saying… ‘He’s able to keep up with the fastest riders…’ LOL. He isn’t racing so I guess he isn’t breaking any rule.
Note: The issue is that he is unaware of his actions, and the system lacks preventive measures to deter such straightforward cheating.
It’s still very wrong. Just because “not racing” doesn’t make it any less wrong.
If it’s okay because “he isn’t racing” then I suggest that it should be allowed in races too.
If it’s not okay for racing, then it’s not okay at all, across the entire Zwift platform. Folks with unrealistic power or who are cheating (e-bike use, etc) are making the experience worse for everyone no matter how much the devils advocates claim otherwise.
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Yeah, I agree.
There is no reason for it.
He can set TD to 0 and trudge up the hills easily without having to use a motor.
He’s not racing but he is “keeping up with the faster guys”.
My wife uses an E bike to keep up with me IRL but she has to ride up the hills for real.
E bikes are a real game changer outdoors but have no place indoors.
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Is there no reason for e-bikes IRL?
I am 65 now, no e-bike. But in some (more or less) years I perhaps will be happy to use one. Must I ride looking on the wall in winter?
You know Joe Friel, don’t you?
“… this past summer I got an email from a 70+ rider who told me he was thinking about getting an e-bike for his easy rides. At first I poo-pooed the idea because e-bikes have always seemed like cheating to me. But the more I thought about it, the better the idea sounded, especially for a place like Sedona. I finally broke down and bought a road e-bike (see picture). What a difference it’s made! Now easy, recovery rides are truly easy regardless of the hills. I’m recovering better, which makes my hard workout days (on a “normal” road bike) truly hard. And I’m able to do more low-intensity riding, which seems to be improving my aerobic fitness.”
That’s why I shared this video—because there are **two kinds of people gaming the system:
- Those who do it intentionally to gain an unfair advantage, exploiting flaws in the system, using inaccurate power sources on purpose, weight doping, etc.
- Those who fall under the Dunning-Kruger effect—unintentional cheating.
This is why implementing dual power source verification is crucial for the future of fair play in virtual cycling. Ensuring accuracy through power source normalization and proper categorization can help level the playing field and create a fairer environment for everyone.
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Joe Friel is great and I do follow many aspects of his health advice.
I stand firmly in my belief that the E bike has allowed my wife and I to enjoy many weekends together.
Yes, the same here.
So why no e-bike on Zwift for people who need it? No racing, of course…
Because there is Trainer Difficulty in Zwift.
Is there a reason why e bikes should be used in Zwift?
In the video that was linked, the guy stated he originally built the e bike to help his spouse with outdoor rides.
He only put it on Zwift to get a since of the power output.
Zwift has TD, rubber banding and other grouping options.
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Not for you, not for me (now), but for some users perhaps? That was what a tried to explain in my first posting. Yes, there are other options - but I don’t understand what is a problem if somebody who has not enough power rides an e-bike.
To stay on topic - cheating is imho a big problem in races, Zwift is not doing enough to reduce it. If it’s not racing - doesn’t matter for me.
Disallow users to attain KOMs, Sprints etc.
I do see the idea behind e-bikes both in real life and it can make zwift enjoyable in that it seems like you are atleast travelling some distance and can ride with others alongside you.
But some people on zwift ride solely for a KOM or a Sprint banner, that might be the highlight of their ride, so I dont think they should potentially lose out on that due to someone on a e-bike.
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I think it’d be fine if Zwift let you choose a virtual e-bike as a bike in-game, and let you tweak how much power assist it would give - maybe it’s something you can control throughout your ride. It would disable KOMs, sprint banners, some achievements, and wouldn’t be allowed in races by default (though race organizers could create an even playing field in some races by allowing a virtual ebike, then individually boosting everyone so they are all evenly top of the category from a power profile perspective I suppose - that might be interesting to see how that shakes out).
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E-bikes are the best thing that ever happened to cycling.
Needs no explanation but:
It brought in a big group of influential people into cycling: older people with disposable income.
Those chaps do not bugger about when it comes to getting what society owes them. Bike lanes, speed cameras, new pavement, policing and more bike friendly businesses.
They vote, they are in the committees, they run companies and organisations.
At a minimum they write angry letters* and follow up.
*For the kiddos: A letter is like a twit, only much longer and on foot.
I’m okay with e-bikes in Zwift so long as they are only used in racing and not elsewhere.
Yes, that’s true and I don’t know why people cannot use it but instead demand an e-bike? Is it because they don’t want to go slow?
I used the TD function when I was badly injured. I didn’t go using an “e-bike” on Zwift, I just set the trainer difficulty to 0 and rode about 3-5km of Tempus at 100w. This was of course with crutches nearby for when I finished and carefully got off the bike.
Old mate in the video seems mobile enough to not need an e-bike.
Maybe because even with TD set at zero, there are almost no rides where they can keep up with everybody else?
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maybe it’s necessary that clubs do more keep-together rides then.
I didn’t have an e-bike to use. I just went slowly and used TD at 0.
But e-bikes so long as they are only in races, and not elsewhere, no problem.
and this video is 6 years old, shows that nothing has been done to combat this
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Nothing will be done against riders with e-bikes. It’s all about the money. The simplest thing would be if e-bikers were always given their own world. The world would have to change and separate the lazy cheats from the serious athletes. Even if you ride at 1.5 watt/kg, you can still be a serious athlete and a real hero if you can cover long distances at this speed.