Personally I think not all CE data thresholds should be made public otherwise Sandbaggers will soon learn how to manipulate it. When you are racing you shouldn’t be looking at stats to keep within certain limits instead racing as hard as you can.
So what you are asking is how does 3.48wkg 20 min equate to a sub 3.3 CP ? I should have read the post more carefully.
Zwift was not using 20 min it was using 95% of 20 Min for ZP Cat boundaries. Between C & B the boundary was 3.2 wkg ( call it what you will FTP or 95% of 20 min)
When they decided to move to CE they continued to use 3.2 for CP boundary. To me this suggested that they saw FTP and CP as exactly the same. There was some debate as to whether they are actually the same or not.
People got confused so a month or so back they posted that people were confused so let’s add this 5% back on again. This took the boundary to 3.36 CP.
95% of 20 min 3.48 = 3.306 (FTP and CP if you consider them the same)
3.306 is less than 3.36 so rider has ability to race Cat C under CE.
Hope this answer meets your satisfaction level which was clearly rock bottom with my last attempt !
Im also conscious whilst we discuss amongst ourselves this is all guesswork to work out if something is broken or not. Another reason why we need transparency.
People have worked out how to manipulate it now, and those who want to do it will do so. Removing information from the wider audience due to the bad faith of a minority(?) is wrong - You are letting the bad actors dictate the terms by which everyone plays along with.
No I don’t think FTP and CP are the same, from what I have read elsewhere. But I think Zwift did otherwise why did they originally just convert the 2.5, 3.2, 4.0 wkg FTP boundaries straight over to the new CP boundaries. I posted such questions at the time with little useful feedback.
I have spent hours reading up on VO2 Max, MAP and CP and tying up riders power outputs across various 3min, 5min, 6min and 12 min times and using several possible calculations, including HighNorth 2, 3 and 4 test, to identify how Zwift actually calculates those three areas.
I know that 3.48 wkg for 20 min is not necessarily going to exactly match up with how Zwift calculate CP using several points from a 2 - 50 minute power curve.
What I think I also know is that in the past 3.48 would have been over the 3.2 FTP B/C boundary but now that Zwift has recently added a further 5% to that boundary it is likely it will be under the new 3.36 CP boundary.
I agree with you on the transparency issue and hope we see a change in this respect soon.
It’s a curve fit through the power curve so if the left hand side goes up (good short term power) the right hand end of the curve can go down (lower CP hence lower cat). Yes this is just as wrong as it sounds.
If you want to categorise people based in power, you might as well just make it 1-5 min power from the outset and ignore 20+ min completely as almost all races are determined by the short term performance (down to 30s or even 15s for the flattest sprints).
This weeks race had a really good tough 12-14 minute finishing climb. If I forget to look next week you might let me know if this rider is not CE cat C next week. I suspect one or two have gone over the CE limit on a 2 point CE calculation I have been looking at.
they use 3 min and somewhere between 10-12 min. they don’t use anything in between so 5 min is basically irrelevant, you can exceed the limits by a huge margin if you have a specific power profile. vo2 is probably derived from 10-12mins and bodyweight. they might calculate long duration CP at some interval but it’s beyond my physical ability to find out what the limit is there if they do
sorry if this is supposed to be like top secret or whatever but zwift never did me any favours and i don’t feel like doing them any more either.
I missed this from Flint. So we don’t actually know what the current thresholds are? Seems nuts to be changing them and not also communicating them (let alone actually displaying them somewhere). How is anyone supposed to help another rider who is confused?
It’s great. It is designed for everyone to be confused so there is actually no help that can or should be offered. I assume there is a bonus incentive for forum topics of Zwift Employees. When your topic comes up often in the forum you get a bigger bonus. Category enforcement is genius from that regard.
It’s also nice that it was started, implemented poorly and then effectively stopped. I assume someone in Zwift just thrives on chaos, miscommunication and disappointments.