Zwift-specific bike fit?

Inspired by this thread.

That got me wondering… would a bike fit optimized for Zwift be different than a fit optimized for outdoor riding? Most people ride with a traditional outdoor bike fit so that their Zwift training transfers over to their outdoor riding. Your outdoor riding position has to be comfortable, allow you to produce power efficiently, and be aerodynamic.

But let’s say you’re an indoor specialist who does 95-100% of their riding on Zwift. Aero doesn’t matter at all - you just need to be comfortable and generate power efficiently. In Watopia, holding 300w in a praying mantis TT position is exactly as fast as holding 300w sitting bolt upright, and you can probably do the latter more comfortably and at a lower heart rate. Should we be riding with “long and low” outdoor bike fits, or would a more upright (or otherwise different) position make more sense?

Most people, ultimately, ride in Zwift not to generate more watts by tweaking their body position but to ride better outside during warm months. Also, most users take their outdoor bike and attach it to Wahoo Kickr or Tacx and do not want to mess up with anything related to their preferred bike set up / saddle.

Who cares how many watts one generates in Zwift, if it is not relevant to real life cycling?

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Who cares how many watts one generates in Zwift, if it is not relevant to real life cycling?

Lots of people? I mentioned “indoor specialists” who do 95-100% of their riding on Zwift (or otherwise indoors). I personally don’t mess with outdoor riding unless it’s a special event with full road closures - it just isn’t worth it anymore. eSports teams and racers would also want any advantage they can get for racing on Zwift.

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Sure, in such circumstances it is a reasonable question to ask, how fit can be optimized specifically for indoor cycling. What I meant to say, is that there are quite a few people who do a lot of riding indoors during cold months but return to outdoor riding when it is warm. Whether or not outdoor riding is worth it, I suppose, depends on where you live and how much traffic you see in your area. I can very well see how bike riding can be a peril in major metro areas.

With fully adjustable and fully integrated bike trainers it should be easy to test a variety of settings.

I have a dedicated trainer bike and it is a more upright relaxed fit.
I previously was of the mind set that I wanted it to be just like my road bike but guess what, IRL road riding and Zwift are two different things.
Out doors, I never get numbness of the groin, on Zwift, I did all the time.
I changed the indoor bike to a more upright flat bar with padded bartends (like a Tron) and it’s way more comfortable.
I don’t worry about position.
My MTB and roadbike are different too.

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The original question was very good, very sincere. I’ve seen such questions elsewhere online, but I’ve not found answers.

Generally the answers that are given about fit and position for a Zwift setup generally range from useless to remonstrative. Either people talk about how it’s their outdoor bike anyway, so whatever, to reasons for personal failings and how to fix them (e.g., “strengthen your core” or “you need to get out of the saddle more”). Even the “it’s all about outdoors anyway,” while fair, is not answering the question. None of those are actual answers.

For example, getting out of your saddle more while on Zwift: cycling upright out of the saddle is potentially destructive to your pedal stroke. After all, the outdoor stroke is elliptical due to the forward motion, and out of saddle on a trainer, it is perfectly circular. For an experienced outdoor rider, this feels weird to the point I feel like I might injure myself. So that is not a good solution and seems to be potentially harmful.

Ultimately the question regards adjustments to a bicycle for indoor riding, not adjustments to the human body. In fact it’s absurd to request adjustments to the human body. Like, do you wait to ride indoors until you’ve made the requisite adjustments to your body? And how do you do that without riding? Oh I’m going to do situps and planks for a month and not ride? Don’t neglect your core, sure, but that’s a trivial fact of life, not a prerequisite for Zwifting.

Like many other Zwifters, I have a second old road bike that I have dedicated to my indoor setup. I have been tweaking it to make it better indoors. Of course, at first it got a training tire. And then another change: I just replaced the crankset with a heavier crankset that has a more optimal crank length for me. Another win. This was a simple change that has alleviated pain I suffer from osteoarthritis in my knee. This was a no-brainer. My indoor crank length now matches my outdoor and that’s better for my actual size.

But I need other adjustments. I’m hoping for help, advice, suggestions that answer the question of fitting the bike for indoors.

I am coming to grips (pun intended) with the need for a more upright position indoors. I just replaced my wide carbon fiber handlebars with narrower shallower (and heavier because indoors) handlebars. However I still feel like my torso is too low forward and too stretched out. As a result I find myself ending up wholly off the bars sitting upright hands-free quite frequently. And when I do that off and on for 80 minutes in a racing saddle I picked for outdoors riding, one that worked great for outdoor riding, well, the result is pain. My tailbone aches on the regular now. If I put the same kind of miles outdoors I’d be slung forward and nose riding and in and out of the saddle and would never be an issue.

Riding indoors is necessarily a more upright riding style. One look at all the spin bikes and indoor cycling bikes of the last 40 years will show you that. Look at the handlebars, look at those saddles. Look at the relative positioning. Look at the lack of forward motion.

So I can already tell the right answer is to move bars upright and obtain a saddle more optimal for upright riding. But 25 years of riding a racing saddle outdoors, I look at those larger seats and imagine terrible chafing and squishiness. What I’d like to hear is that, for those who have in fact figured this out, how are you changing your indoor position, and what are you using to do it? Are you replacing your stem? Shortening your reach? What saddles are more optimal for indoor riding?

One idea I’ve been toying with is to get one of those adjustable stems. Another is to find a saddle more appropriate for sitting but one that won’t chafe me.

I’m not an indoor racer. I need it for indoor exercise. It’s the only exercise I actually enjoy and like anyone else I need it for my health and wellness. This is all about making it easier to get into the saddle five days a week, tolerating 60-90 minutes, and not feeling physically destroyed off the bike. I also have a chronic inflammatory disease, and exercise is critical to my life. Winning a sprint, KOM or race is simply irrelevant. I just want to ride: indoors when the outdoors are prohibitive, and outdoors because that’s the beauty of it all.

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I get this is a zombie thread but still a good subject.
I converted a dropbar road bike to a dedicated trainer bike by raising the bar ht and making it a flat bar bike with bar ends.
It kind of looks like a Tron bike but not slammed.
My opinion but I think it’s useful not to ride locked in the same position all the time.
Different saddle to accommodate the change in geometry.

My bike fit for Zwift (on Kickr Bike) is whatever is comfortable. It’s not too far removed from my IRL bike fit.

Which is because I’m doing Zwift to build fitness for my outdoor riding, I’m not interested in racing on Zwift, I ignore the event rides - I just do my own riding on the steepest routes there are.

My body isn’t what it used to be, so I can’t spend 2 hours riding around with a robopacer group, that’s not comfortable (it gets very painful actually), it is not efficient use of time and also not very enjoyable with all the pace dynamics changes back and forwards.

1h:15 minutes on Road to Sky (which gets a lap of ADZ and back down to the start of the climb) is enough.