The power that a 4.2w/kg robopacer would put out is 252w, versus 315w for the 75kg one. That’s a big difference. Others like Alice before have already told you the differences but you choose to argue against it or trip people up in details.
It’s not like people are asking to take away your 75kg robopacers, they are asking to supplement them with more lighter ones.
Okay but what difference does it make to the bot at the standard weight?
That it goes slightly faster on the flats?
Okay, so choose a bot that’s more fitting to your pace; or modify your setup to make it work… there are solutions here already in place.
Everyone always asks for more bots.
But what is the “problem” that a different weight bot solves???
Speeds slightly between the bots we already have?
Because I’m not getting what weight has to do with just the request for more bots.
There are 82 votes here, lots of people asking for this with reasons, read the room.
I’m reading it, but there isn’t an answer as to what weight has to do with anything besides “I want more bots.”
The argument is that lighter people get shifted around in PD and we have to fight for our positions.
What difference does it make when the blob around a bot will average roughly the same they do right now?
Does anyone in this thread genuinely think that if they saw the weight of the bot, they would be more attracted to joining it; unrelated to pace?
The only thing that’s going to change is how often the bot gets shoved around and doesn’t ride at whatever pace that makes them particularly happy that day.
People complain about that enough already…
Until anyone can solve my question of how does the average user who doesn’t read, understand what any of this has to do with anything; then this whole thread continues to remain pointless.
The women of Zwift want this plus light males. They know why it will make difference. It’s not about speed or wkg.
It still sounds to me like the real solution is a request for the return of steady bots; ones that don’t adjust at all.
Because I fail to see why weight would change the dynamic once a group gets around any bot.
Heavy people will still join the bot, and drag it down the descents.
It will still be shoved to the back before a climb, and zip through on an incline.
These are the things nobody is coming up with answers to the “why” weight matters.
Because all I can understand is the request for:
For the sake of adding more detail for hopefully… someone at ZHQ.
It should be noted that we haven’t had steady RP’s since PD3…
So the old votes and data on who wants dynamic bots… needs be revisiting.
50kg bots is the request in the title
I’m sure you will be able to move the pedals when adjusting your weight to 75kg.
I’m reposting my original answer to your question Andrew … that you’ve chosen to ignore 
Read on…
I’m guessing you might be closer to 75kg than I or Cat or most of the female zwifters to make this comment ‘watts are watts- just ride with a slower bot’ that shows no understanding of the impact it’s having on our experience. The demotivating effect it is having to have gone from pre PD5 and being able to ride 100km with Yumi with friends to now falling off Maria pushing 3wpk whilst the 75kgers ride at the advertised 2.2wpk pace overtaking you. It’s frustrating and demoralising. It’s not just with Pace Bots. It’s all group rides - so @50kg you join a 2.5wpk advertised ride and end up having to push 3wpk and still fall off the back. It’s a negative feature change not a positive one and we are feeding it back and asking for change
I think the disconnect is:
Problem: you’ve changed pack dynamics recently and that change has ruined our experience!
Proposed solution in this thread: Add something tangentially related that only addresses half of the problem!
Because your group ride experience is still going to be awful if PD5 is the issue, right?
FWIW I have no skin in this game as a 72kg-ish outstandingly mediocre man. Quite happy to have a smorgasbord of RoboPacers of different lower and higher weights. I’d be even happier to have a fix for the actual problem - for me, you and everyone else.
ETA: Pacing group rides by wkg has always been an issue when the leader has been heavier and producing more raw watts than lighter riders. I’m guessing the recent change is a straw / camel’s back interface issue.
Zwift will always be (it seems) “adjusting” pack dynamics. The lighter bots thing has been asked for since all the Bots got moved to 75kg a few years back. Yes the latest iteration of pack dynamics was the final straw that called for the lighter bots thing to be resurfaced. The odd behaving pack dynamics has taken over this thread somewhat and needs it’s own separate thread, as it’s clear a lot are not enamoured with it. Adding additional 50kg bots would be awesome for most females, juniors and lighter males. I would love to ride with a bot that doesn’t follow the heavier riders - a 50kg bot will get dropped by those pulling the front - unlike a 75kg bot.
I hear ya. We also have plenty of people wanting (effectively) heavier bots as well, because when someone who weighs 100kg says they want a fixed-wattage bot, that’s effectively wanting a fix to the opposite problem to yours - you’re fine climbing, but it’s hard on the flats; they get shelled when the road turns up.
Totally agree that there are two separate issues here. A new thread (with some illustrative video from group rides) would be helpful, i think …
Zwift go on and on about being all inclusive and yet they have Bots which have an average weight of 75kg which is a male based average. Come on Zwift actually act like you really want to be inclusive. I should also add that plenty of young riders struggle with the bots so think of the young people who would benefit from bots with a lighter weight. Currently the Bots exclude most women, light male riders and all young riders…not very inclusive is it
I’m a far ways away from the average weight for the men.
Am I 40kg range, no… but there are still benefits to being of an excessively lower weight as well when extreme speed boosts are given to extreme lightweight riders.
I absolutely am relevant to this discussion; but I also care a lot less about the RP’s because I don’t believe they are that great of a feature for a number of reasons, and personally don’t care to see many more because they’re more of an annoyance when they do come around and everything in the world around me in Zwift disappears because a bot with 300 people are hovering around it.
I also don’t go outside riding and see someone 10-15lbs skinnier than me passing me for less effort on all flat and upward grades due to w/kg differences… it’s still the opposite.
But that is how it works in Zwift once you get down into those weight ranges.
(Before anyone flips their lid on this I am referring to a watts to watts comparison; not w/kg; where Zwift gives a very generous boost in speed to lower weight, higher w/kg riders versus IRL.)
The way I see it, this thread is more arguing for removal of w/kg comparisons, at least in the sense of public world riding.
When I lead our C rides I aim for 3w/kg to settle the average group pace to 2.7 which is still usually not quite enough but close enough for everyone to agree they’re happy with the pace.
The only thing you’re pointing out K, is the advertised w/kg “is wrong.”
The argument to go to a different method has been requested, but ultimately runs into the same issue: What is used as the reference for a bot?
It can’t be speed; we’ve been over that one, and that doesn’t work when a bot like Coco ends up at higher speeds due to larger blobs.
It sort of already is the Pace Category “CE”
ZRS?
I’m out of ideas personally… I don’t think there is an answer because of all variables involved; not as a “one size fits all” that is.
Maybe ACTUAL solution here…???
Represent the w/kg requirements in events, bots, etc. whatever else, from the USER’s weight.
ie: as just previously mentioned I have to ride ~3 when leading our group rides to aim for the average weight rider to hit 2.7 as advertised.
This also solves the statement I mentioned last night over the “confusion factor”.
This is a simple calculation ZHQ can come up with, and there’s no reason as to why it can not, or should not exist.
That also helps people better fit themselves for event rides, where they know where THEY need to be power wise; not… having to guess about what it might be due to their difference from that rough 75kg mark.
Y’all might think I’m against all of this for some reason, but I’m trying to point out that the issue at hand isn’t going to be fixed by “making more”, when it isn’t the problem in the first place.
The problem is that power requirements (listed w/kg) have little relation to anyone outside the bounds of ‘the ride leader.’ And you either learn where you are in relation to those numbers, or, you pay no attention to it and give up trying to understand it.
(and the remainder is complaints about Pack Dynamics, but we all know that isn’t ever going back to previous versions).
The “issue” with the request of a lighter bot, is then how, seeing how great ZHQ is at UI/UX…
Differentiate a lightweight bot, who will be traveling at a lower speed, at a higher w/kg… to the average user?
Again… see “confusion factor.” Which nobody here has yet to answer how this fixes anything.
Because once said bot collects hundreds of riders of all weights; it will suffer … literally the same issues the current bots have. A 50kg bot absolutely would get pulled away just as much as a 75kg bot gets pulled away right now; there are still hard limits.
But that as an issue… isn’t going to be fixed by weight differentials.
Just as I get dropped very quickly on descents in my races, (and have to do a sprint to get around anyone on the climbs because they’re near same w/kg but much higher power… thanks Category Enforcement…), as soon as someone heavier gets around me on a descent, I’m generally glued to them… a bot will be no different.
This is why I just don’t care for the bots most days, because at peak hours, riding with Coco ends up being significantly more difficult than riding with Yumi.; not just in terms of power, but in ability to stay with the bot.
Still have to get through the biggest issue of trying to explain to users in the main menu that a bot weighs less, and might have a (by number) higher “power” [w/kg] requirements… to only go slower…
WE WOULD STILL LIKE 50KG BOTS. I think another thread is needed on the pack dynamics as it has hijacked this post.
Well ya; because the RP’s are directly correlated to PD.
It is literally the determining factor of why RP’s are as inconsistent as they are, hour by hour, day by day.
If it weren’t for PD4+'s ‘you can’t pass this rider’ checks… would this thread even exist?
I’m pretty sure … you’re gonna be told again what you want Cat 
.
“Zwift will always be (it seems) “adjusting” pack dynamics. The lighter bots thing has been asked for since all the Bots got moved to 75kg a few years back. Yes the latest iteration of pack dynamics was the final straw that called for the lighter bots thing to be resurfaced. The odd behaving pack dynamics has taken over this thread somewhat and needs it’s own separate thread, as it’s clear a lot are not enamoured with it. Adding additional 50kg bots would be awesome for most females, juniors and lighter males. I would love to ride with a bot that doesn’t follow the heavier riders - a 50kg bot will get dropped by those pulling the front - unlike a 75kg bot.”
May I ask that you set up a separate thread to discuss PDs away from this post. Yes there is a link but it doesn’t mean it has to hijack this request.
It’s hardly a hijack; it’s just an opposition that the request is only going to bring more confusion to a customerbase that is already confused majority of the time.
In this respect I have a question, black and white, with no meaning behind it, but better understanding:
When you are requested to lead a ride where the ride leader is of average weight, and the userbase that joins the ride has a set expectation level of THEIR requirement pace-wise…
Do you adjust yourself to the normal ride leader?
Or do you make everyone else adjust for you?
I’ve spent entire rides more than once explaining to people who joined a group ride as to why pace differs… something we all know Zwift barely explains and relies on the customers to try to understand it, or ignore it and find what suits them by trial and error.
Spitting out more RPs with wonky reference numbers will only add to the already existing confusion.
At the end of the day, your 50kg bot is still going to get sucked away by front-runners…
I don’t understand why you think this would be any different.
These are the numbers for Coco and Maria now:
Coco, 175 cm, 75 kgs, 2.6 w/kg
Maria, 175 cm, 75 kgs, 2.2 w/kg
If they were to introduce 50 kilograms version of these 2 bots:
Coco light, 175 cm, 50 kgs, 2.6 w/kg
Maria light, 175 cm, 50 kgs, 2.2 w/kg
Coco light’s pace on the flat will perfectly match Maria’s (standard Maria) pace. So the valid consideration here is that Zwift, knowing there isn’t enough participation to have tens of robopacers to cater for everyone’s weight, they tried to go the middle ground, with the consideration that everyone understands that lighter riders will have to push more w/kg on the flats and heavier riders will be able to do less. When you can’t or you’re not willing to do this, you’d simply switch to a faster/slower robopacers. There’s a level that fits you. A level where even a 45 kilo rider’s 140w will produce a higher speed on the flats than some 75 kgs robopacers. The issue is, of course, suddenly the pace on the climbs doesn’t fit. And I agree. However, consider for every 50 kilogram rider complaining about the flat speeds not matching their level, there’s a just as important 100 kg rider complaining the climbing speeds are not matching theirs. No serious company (at least in my opinion) will introduce 50 kgs bots, leave the 75 kgs bots alone and completely ignore the other end of the spectrum (the 100 kgs riders). So, I would argue, a productive way to approach this is:
I believe that for #2, a single solution fits all, would be to drop the weight of all robopacers by 10 kgs (to 65). Flat speeds would be reduced giving an easier ride to anyone who is lighter. Heavier riders will either accept an easier ride or sit more towards the front pulling the pack. Climbing situations is where things will not match exactly, but, given the ratio between flat and climbing in pretty much all routes done by the Robopacers, one could argue this solution is the lesser evil.