Zwift Power and Group Recommendation

I have been letting my race group be determined by Zwift Power. I started out in Group D and then was upgraded to Group C because my 95% of 20 min was 206 watts / 2.55 wkg. I had no issue with this until I did the race. The gate was lifted and within 2 minutes I was dropped by the entire group and ended up riding by myself for 10 miles. This is the part that was frustrating. No one wants to ride alone because you can’t draft or do lead outs or bridge the gap. There is no teaming.

Hence I downgraded myself back to D the other day. The advantage of going back to D is I have a group to race with, I can draft and bridge to the next group. I end up finishing in the middle of the pack.

So my point is maybe the power range is a little too wide or I am just on the cusp between the top of 2.4 for Group D and the bottom of Group C which is 2.5.

Long story short I will continue ride in Group D because it is more fun but if there is an opportunity to revisit and make the brackets more granular it may be something to consider.

I love riding with Zwift. Keep up the good work Team. Ride On.

Bob

This is part of the problem a lot of people feel this way, so what happen is the lower A’s race B cat, the Lower B’s race C Cat, the Lower C’s race D Cat, the Lower D’s don’t race.

It wont be that big jump if people would race in the correct Cat.

See this post for more info.

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I have to admit, I don’t understand your comment or frustration.
Unless you are in a handicapped race such as Hare and Hounds, everybody starts together and you just race the riders around you.

Because I am on the cusp, there are no racers around me. After the first two minutes everyone is gone so I end up racing by myself for 10 miles or whatever the distance. I do get it. It is discouraging. And I get it is discouraging for the group D rides to have no one to ride with.

Yes at 2.5 watt/kg I should be in group C but it is more fun riding in a group throughout the race and finishing in the middle of the pack in Group D than riding by myself in Group C.

Honestly, I do not mind finishing last. That does not bother me, it is not being able to ride with or interact a group in a peloton; no drafting, no bridging. I might as well just go for a ride by myself. It feels the same.

bob

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So Bob - are you middle of the pack on ZwiftPower, or middle of the pack in the race? This is kind of one of those - everyone else does, so…
To a point, you’re right. The start of the race is a crazy sprint, and if you don’t keep up you get dropped. I usually find though, that most of the guys that dropped me when I was right around 2.5 W/kg were disqualified on ZP. That was me 2 weeks ago. A couple big efforts and I seem to have broken through a plateau, and all the sudden am up around 3 W/kg in races. Now, I have no kick left and am using everything I have to stay with the pack, but I’m enjoying C races, and on ZP middle-ish.
I’d encourage being in the right category - ZP will probably drop you down if you have a couple races just under 2.5 W/kg. In fact, you might want to weigh yourself and see if you gained a kg or 2.

Thank you for the thoughtful reply. When riding in D I am in the top 28% when riding in C after the gate is dropped I get dropped and then ride by myself for the remainder of the race since I am last.

It is not being last that bothers me it is not having anyone to compete with. Hence I might as well ride by myself OR I could just sign up for a group ride.

When I rode the two Cat C races my watts/kg were under 2.5. I have attached the data. Granted these were two hilly races.

My Zwift Power ratings are attached here.

Zpower profile

I guess I was expecting something different. Clearly, according to Zwift Power I should be in C. I am not disputing that. When I raced in C my power was at the top of the D group at 2.2 and 2.4. When I demoted myself back to D my power increased. Go figure?. Maybe because these were flat routes?

I ride outside by myself a lot so it is not a big deal. I thought I would try a race event and I did have fun in the D group just because I was interacting with others. My goal/objective is not to win; could care less. It is mostly just to be competitive with others. At my age of 66 winning is not the objective, surviving and staying in shape is the objective.

I will try a couple more C rides and if I end up riding the route by myself I will just stop racing and ride in groups or by myself.

thanks for the feed back. Ride On

bob

I also see an issue.
The races in the screen shots were Tour of Watopia races.
These were set up to just show the other riders in your class.
I’m sorry, I did not realize this was the experience you were describing.

If you enter any other race, you will be with the same riders, regardless of your cat or their cat.

You all will take off together and the same people who would be with you as a mid pack D will still be there even if your a Cat C.
You wont be alone.

Thanks Tim. That is encouraging. I did not know Watopia was set up that way. It was pretty discouraging to ride 17-20 km as basically the only rider. Even when I do a basic ride in Watopia or New York there are other riders around.

Thanks

bob

Im going to add some advise.

The only way to get stronger in the starts is to race with stronger riders.

When I was a low C I would jump in rides just to see how long I can last before getting dropped. London was my challenge I could not hold on to Travalgar square.

So I would practice that week after week.

What a feeling the first time I could hang on.

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Gerrie,
I rode a group C race today. There were lots of people which was cool. I could draft and compete with others. I had fun and was not riding alone. I was happy to hang in there and ride with others. Will continue riding with the C group. As you said, it can only make me better…

Thanks
Bob

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Hi Gerrie,
I rode the Trofeo Bologna Race © this evening April 14, 2020 at 1930 Mountain Time in Colorado, USA. First I had fun. The last part up the hill was killer. What I did notice in the companion app after the race it appears 25 out of 37 entrants were out of group with watts/kg numbers ranging from 3.2 - 4.8. Look at finisher #9 for example or finisher #1. In fact the top 10 finishers were at power ratings of 3.7 or higher.
Again, I had fun, got to draft and drop some on the hill climb so it was all good just think those who are WAY out of group should not even appear in the finish list but instead be filtered out. Just saying.

Bob

@BH_RN

That sound about normal, it has bee a problem since 2015 that is why Zwiftpower has come into action, to give people real race placings and to try and encourage people to ride in the correct group.

Please vote for this request.
Auto-Assign Race Categories

Zwift is working on a short term solution. :sunglasses:

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You should join group rides. Why do you want to race? There are many group events for you. There you are able to draft in a fast group. Some rides end with a fun race too.

I was thinking if ZP provided a feedback loop into the Companion app eliminating those who exceeded the power to wt ratio of the Group that would or could discourage them b/c they would no longer see there names and finish position post race. Speaking from experience when I downgraded from C to D and went to ZP I saw I was not in the race listing. Then the light bulb went off.
Ride On everyone.

Bob

Hi guys! Im new to Zwift Power, since TDF started actually… its been really interesting watching all those numbers etc but until today, I noticed a difference on time from the one displayed Once I completed the Virtual TDF Stage 6 Discovery Ride: Zwift 1h 03’ 22 vs ZwiftPower 1h07’00… why this difference??? Tks :slight_smile: