hi everyone,
I´ve been listen to different couches suggesting the Norwegian 4x4 workout to improve VO2 max.
Does anyone can recommend anything similar on Zwift workouts? Or any other VO2 max that can be doable (The Wringer seems like digging my grave). The Gorby perhpas?
what are your experience and sugestions.
thanks a lot!
I just pick a route and ride and use the Elapsed Time clock to track my intervals.
That’s what’s so nice about the Norwegian 4 X 4, it is simple.
Set the trainer difficulty to zero, shift to a harder gear and just go hit your power goals.
If 4 min at VO2 max is too hard and you’re slipping into a hard threshold effort, then do 3 min efforts but keep your rest periods a full 4 min or just add extra time to the 4X4.
Thanks Tim.
Im looking to see if there is any ready to go workout that reflects this… are you doing how much % of your FTP ?
I’m doing 120-130% FTP but only doing 4 X 3 min.
O just tried by 120% 4x but I have to put 5% down after the second…
Im assuming that you have to be able to finish and not a full gas effort…
Yes, that is an example of the effort drifting down to hard threshold effort so you’re no longer targeting your goal.
Keep the intensity up but back off to 2 or 3 minute interval.
I make sure my rest periods are as long as my work intervals ie 2 on then 2 off or 3 on then 3 off etc.
You need to be recovered enough to do the interval.
If you need to add a extra minute, do it.
I consider VO2 max work outs similar to lifting weights.
In the weight room people have no problem recovering between sets or working in sets with 1-2 other lifters, especially if doing heavy or max weights.
VO2 max intervals are cycling’s version of heavy lifting so recover between sets, not full rest.
This is just my formula for VO2 max.
My sweet spot workouts have shorter recovery and I want to carry some fatigue in those intervals.
Great,thanks
I got a good insight as well saying that when you finish it, you should be feeling like you could do another one, if your life depended on it :).
I think my first trial was almost in the right spot. I will start with 115% and see how it goes. I guess it’s a matter of finding out the right spot.
Btw, how is your sweet spot wirkout organized? And how you plan your week?
There are so many controversial information out there. I just listen to another coach saying that 80% volume in Zone 2 is mostly effective for people that do more then 10 hours a week. For 6-7 hrs, some say it’s a waste of the time…others say it’s helpful. In my own experience, it’s not working to my power curve. I’m stagnated and I’m doing 80% in Zone 2 but not more then 9 hours a week (winter indoors)
Thanks again for the insights.
OK, I’ll share with you what I do but in no way will I try to convince you what to do.
I can give reasons for what I do and it seems to work for me but everything I do, there are alternative views that are not wrong.
This may suggest that the real secret is periodization.
Do something for a while then switch it up.
Ok. I’m 61 years old.
I XC MTB ride and road ride with a spirited group .
I ride 6 hours per week, 4 days riding with 3 days rest.
In door trainer work:
2-3 hour zone 2, defined by HR zone.
2 X 15 min Sweetspot. (Working up to 3 x 20)
3 x 3 min VO2 max (working up to 4 x4)
Race day.
Those are my 4 rides per week.
All rides are proceeded by 15-20 min to warm up and calibrate trainer. I finish up the rides at high zone 2 / tempo to round out the hour.
I see many people questioning zone 2 or ask zone 2 vs Sweetspot.
The answer is both.
They do 2 different things and both are important. It’s not a waste of time for me at the present time.
It’s like asking, do you want front wheels or rear wheels?
And here’s some advice for family gatherings and parties, avoid politics, religion and training plans.
To give a comment on your training, 80 % is a lot of zone 2. I might do that for an initial base training block.
My zone 2 tends to be about 30% of my time.
Also, I recommend using HR for zone 2.
I monitor power but I define zone 2 by HR and I don’t try to ride high zone 2.
I think I have heard that we should not try to be Zone 2 heros meaning slow down and ride well into the middle of zone 2.
I will freq do a few 30/30 intervals to break it up.
Hahaha. Great tips Tim.
Experience helps a lot to define what is working or not.
I noticed as well that Zone 2 power is a bit harder then the HR. I’m also backing a little bit and extend the volume…
Now will do a bit more of V02 max once a week and 2 Zwift races…let’s se..
Cheers
Hey, I wanted to ask, why do you feel you have stagnated?
If it is because your FTP is not moving, that might not be an accurate measure for you as a complete cyclist.
The FTP is a tool that we use to set your training intervals and you chose the type of intervals to achieve your goals
I’ll give an example.
The workout that I described above is my current workout but it’s not the one I did last year
Last year I just did Zone 2 and VO2. max
I feel I had an improvement in my power but I had late race fade and my FTP didn’t really increase
I incorporated the Sweetspot intervals to improve the 2nd half and late race fade and I feel it has really helped.
At the end of a race, I can hold a higher power longer
My FTP hasn’t really changed but I don’t feel stagnant. I used the ftp to set my sweet spot power and I do those intervals
I used to be around 3.1 w/kg and put some mass, pushing me to 2,9 W/kg. im aware that FTP can have a significant change (error due to measurements, etc) but im looking to my performance in races as well power output vs effort needed. I think i know where to improve (e,g 5 min power) and i would like to push the overall fitness from the top and bottom (VO2 max and aerobic endurance). I spend a significant amount of time on the bike and i think that the numbers should be a bit better then the actual ones. Thats why. I even reached a FTP of 275W last year and this year i have a very realistic one of 250W