The problem is that PD4 does not know if it is the anomalous type or the normal type.
Depends. Not if youâre on your own or in a spread out field. I raced irl crit on Sunday with a descent. Pace was on but if the bunch was descending and I had no clean air or the ability to move to the edge I had to brake.
IRL you canât just ride through people just to maintain your free speed
My wifi set-up probably qualifies for vintage status but Iâve never noticed any obvious problems when Zwifting (PD3 or PD4).
Iâm also using a Neo 2T paired directly to the app on ATV (no power meter pedals or cranks as my primary power source) and, so far, PD4 seems very similar to PD3 with my riding style.
Iâd be very surprised if there werenât some PD4 quirks due to the different hardware setups and trainers etc.
Yes, it depends as you say. If you sprint and time it so you get into the draft of the pack, but not go into the pack, you should not have to touch the brakes.
Thatâs a completely different thing and isnât prevented by PD4.
If I do that on Kickr Bike I get slowed down fast. But my pedal style is that I keep spinning - because I donât have big watts (canât do sprint/coast technique) so I canât afford to ease off completely or I slow down.
If the PD4 means the sprinters canât just sit in and roll to a sprint victory at the end thatâs good. IRL you can get some smaller riders burning the legs of the others. Thatâs good. Obviously the sprinters wonât like it because they will have to work together better.
But isnât that how it works IRL on flatter courses?
Yes indeed, thatâs how it works.
I watched (as a Commissaire) one of our younger club members (still junior) ride away from a bunch of heavy A graders (all of them from the same rival club) who were trying to use team tactics to burn our youngster. Each lap one of the big guys would try a push and let the others rest a bit.
Our young rider dropped them every lap at a tight technical corner and made them sprint back the gap lap after lap, then about half way said okay, youâve had your fun now bye-bye and rode away from the heavy guys. 
Helps that he was short, very light and with decent FTP and demon cornering skills.
Officially Iâm neutral there, but you couldnât help but be pretty happy to see that, it was brilliant. 
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I think that is an exception. It could just as well have been one of the heavier riders who had that cornering skill (yes, the heavier riders will have to use more energy to accelerate out of the corner). There are no skills like that in Zwift, so the heavier more powerful riders will have an advantage on flatter courses. I read all the time about lighter riders who struggle on the flat and on descends.
You donât want to change the physics of riding a bike, would you?
IRL if the pack does not organize or some riders donât sacrifice themselves to pull back the gaps, a strong and committed couple/few riders can take the race. Even at top pro level. It just happens so much less there because being top pro teams, they are organized.
Zwift being a whole bunch of⌠us⌠it ought to be a whole lot easier to get breaks going even on what ought to be a sprint finish course.
It ought to be easy to go in a break, but also easy for the peloton to catch the break with a little more rotation at the front than in the break. The number of riders in the peloton is also greater than in the break, so in theory, it should be easy.
PD4 will make the peloton work harder than the break at the front to catch them, and that is good. We will see more collaboration in the peloton or more riders closing attempted brakes. I think the latter will happen. The racers will not allow a break to happen.
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We need a bot for this thread to correct all the instances where break is used instead of brake, and vice versa.
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If that was directed toward me, I apologize! I have to read up on the difference 
I hope you understand what I mean and can see past my bad English. If you were writing Norwegian, I would probably get pretty annoyed by your bad grammar and wording. Again, Iâm sorry!
EDIT: I can understand your point of view and appreciate the humor in it. I just wanted to play the role of a victim 
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Certainly not directed at any one person and I should have considered it as a 2nd language for some posters. And youâre right, my Norwegian is terrible! Your English is excellent 
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Exactly how it should be, the followers shouldnât just get to cruise along and know the churning effect and very high speed will help them close down any gaps.
They should have to work well as a team to close the gap then let the games begin when they start plotting against each other.
No one is opposed to the idea of successful breakaways when the pack is not cooperating. The problem is that it is not possible to cooperate in the pack with PD4. Itâs very choppy in the pack, if the front of the pack is pushing it to catch the breakaway. None of that âtaking turnsâ, âorganizingâ is happening. It turns into an absolute smash fest and carnage. Everything gets strung out and I donât think PD4 behaves well when the pack is strung out.
This dream scenario of âpeloton working togetherâ to catch the breakaway just canât materialize with PD4. All PD4 has done so far is to reduce pack speed significantly so breakaways are successful, at the expense of smoothness in the pack.
I would love to see how messy TTTs will be when PD4 rolls out universally.
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Itâs going to be fun to be the guy on back getting braked every time your power fluctuates downward a little bit then sprinting to catch back on then getting braked again.
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When the front of the pack accelerates and youâre at the back, you sprint to catch up and then ease off, intending to roll further into the draft. However, this doesnât happen as expected. Instead, you are automatically slowed down to match the speed of the rider in front of you, who is traveling 2 km/h slower. You had planned to overtake them using your momentum, but now you must repeat the process. This issue affects others around you, who also respond to the frontâs acceleration.
A 3 km/h speed difference may not be significant in a group ride at 25 km/h, but it demands significantly more energy in a race situation at 55 km/h.
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I see what youâre saying but from my experience (and I have raced PD4 events exclusively since January) you sprint but as you catch back on just ease the power gradually and you will continue forward past a few riders, if you abruptly drop power you get braked the the rider you just caught. Itâs just a small change in style that is required to maintain similar behaviour to PD3.
The big difference which we agree on is that the front of the bunch should be riding as hard (or harder) than a breakaway to catch it and not rely on bunch churn to automatically catch any breakaway. This outweighs any tiny issues with PD4, PD3 is hardly perfect.
Donât let perfect be the enemy of good 
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