Category Enforcement Test Events - 21-28 Feb 2022

They are already allowed to sign up for events.

This is more tricky because we start talking about consent and whether it’s okay for things like their name, weight and heart rate information to be shared with all other registered Zwiftpower users. I don’t have a solution for that I’m afraid.

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I am wondering if the end game might just have to involve at least more reliance on this especially at the less taken serious (for want of a better phrase) of the racing portfolio. It sure does remove all the endless quest for perfection here ( that in itself IMO is just counter intuitively a self fulfilment road to stagnant and boring race events) .

It starts to foster instead a re-focusing of what personal satisfaction and racing is about , not winning but just feeling you had a good one and competed with wherever you were in the field. Dare I say it a perspective on improvement and goal setting . In practical terms getting dropped in a race is no longer a long slow death to the end as there will be another group to come along in most cases to settle into.
It might also foster more risk taking breakaway attempts as a result in the front groups.

The only area where this is not going to be instantly good would be at the very top which is where ranking/points probably comes in (might might be how we make A cat racing more vibrant insead of an end game) this will counter the feeling of disappointment that being promoted to cat A is a simple entry into a racing fraternity where you will always be an also ran into an opportunity to launch into some new progression) .and the very bottom where perhaps we might have not put enough thought into how to create events specifically for that space , and not just seeing it as some group of users assigned an alpha number in a sequence . I will only plant the seed for some creative thinking on this here because it might be going off topic .

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I don’t need to win, and I hope I’m not coming across that way. I just think with this many people on Zwift, they can create more Categories, and henceforth make the gaps smaller. Here in Idaho we combine Cats IRL races because #'s are small, and just like my test race, the split was quick. Zero reason they can’t add 2 cat’s and shrink the power spread in all of the groups outside of A’s maybe. I’m sad because this will take away my favorite aspect / motivation for Zwift.

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You have to take down older values. It´s logical.
For exemple: your CTL is based on your last 42 days of training.

If, for some reason, you can´t train for 2 months, your numbers will take a big hit, especially if you were (very close) to your top shape before the pause.

From reading this thread it’s clear there are a lot more people cruising in C than I had thought. I assume this would be helped by adding a couple more categories.

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10 posts were split to a new topic: Race ranking - Will it work

Will motivate to keep training. Even after breaking things you can be at a decent level soon enough. It also should not be a shock that if you did not train you will be at back. Shouldnt be made easier for you quickly so people can ‘win’ again.

B races in the test events are markedly slower-paced in my limited experience. I did one yesterday (Richmond) and spent large chunks on the flats with the lead group @ 2.5 w/kg. I’m no climber, so when the series of quick hills hit I was in distress, but it was still a lot of fun to be had even once disconnected from the winners.

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I’ve tried to tidy up the Crit City race posts and move them to a new thread.

I might have missed some or moved some that aren’t connected, so if you spot anything specific let me know and I can move it.

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Just for fun, I was comparing my ZP numbers to a guy who took 8th in the C category yesterday while I was trashed in B. 11:00 MST test ride 2/24/22
His 15 sec. = 11.73 Me = 7.26
1 min 5.73 Me 4.85
5 min 3.80 Me 3.98
20 min 3.38 Me 3.33
90 day avg. =3.20 Me 3.15

He stays C, and I’m cannon fodder in B
Clear as mud.

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Not quite an apples-for-apples comparison as the guy who came 8th in C is a lightweight rider? If anything I might suggest the guy who came in 11th in C as he has a similar weight and raw W to you (if I have the right Doak on ZP - you finished 38th in the Cat Enforcement race?)

If I’m looking at the right ZP profile then I suspect you crossed the CP boundary for the upgrade as you did 3.23 W/kg for 40 minutes when you won the 3R race on Feb 13. Your recent record in C is mighty impressive, top 5 in 9/10 of the most recent C races with 3 wins, a 2nd and 2 3rds.

I sympathize with being bottom of Bs, although I’d love to be there :slightly_smiling_face:! Yes perhaps more categories are needed, but in the meantime have you thought about mixed Cat events or even age-based events to get your racing fix?

My point continues to be the gap is to wide. If I’m that dominate in C, I should at least be able to hang onto the back of the new B, and there is just no way. I don’t need to be towards the top, just somewhat in touch with my supposed new cat. I’m about to give it another go so we’ll see how it goes. So far not happy nor impressed.

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yep I agree before a wider rollout it would probably be good to get more detail to the user base on how things are calculated or it will cause a bit of confusion.

in this instance i believe the rider you mention escaped an upgrade to b because they are below power floors of 200w (@James_Zwift is that a thing on new category enforcement yet?, would be good to review power floors as it’s required but not as zp does it which also has it’s faults)

As for your race yesterday yes I see you look to have been a bit like cannon fodder but unsure if i would put that down to the field being too strong or you having and off day based on your power chart you were a bit below your best.

I’d suggest giving another couple races a test ideally without doing a hard race the day before to see where you end up. Looking at your race history you have been consistently within the top 5 finishers of C races and some decent results in B.

i admit you are probably an edge case which is why I’d like to see organisers the flexibility to set boundaries as well

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This has nothing to do with a gap, there is no gap between top C and bottom B. It is so simple - 4 categories, somewhere are the (sharp) boundaries. It is nice to be top in a category, not nice near bottom.
I’m C cat with 2.52 W/kg, 0.02 above D/C boundary. If I would change my weight +1 kg I could race in D…

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So maybe an obvious dumb question, but with the cat enforcement events, it’s impossible to get a WKG zwiftpower DQ ?

Yes, I believe they shut that off for these events.

Perhaps you can, maybe there is some low hanging fruit such as racecraft, how you draft etc? Or perhaps you can focus on 1-5 minute power to hang with the initial fast start?

Also you’re basing this statement on a single B race - could you have just been on an off-day?

Seen lots of this!

Just finished the test event around the Three Village Loop. The only oddity was that the results for the C group were shown under the D category at the end of the race.

by gap I’m suggesting a 6-7 W/kg spread instead of 10 from top to bottom.