Hi everyone. just finished Stage 3 and it was bruuutal.
right from the beginning i could see only dust ;/.
i checked out the top 10 in my cat (350-450) and saw that they managed to put an avg 3.7W/kg. would this be a Cat B before? i was on the B but thankfully downgraded back to C (still dont know why i was upgraded).
Perhaps i need to re adjust in the new ranking in order to find a competitive group rank or is about the Zwift games that put some extra watts on everyone…?
cheers
Hi,
yes it can be that hard especially on a punchy course. although i don’t think ZRS is really working that well right now.
there are two many outliers to the different cats that can make races pretty hard for some.
imo Zwift Games is probably about the worst experience you can get racing on zwift.
Riders can currently have a Racing Score just under 450 because bad results put them at their lowest possible score, which is currently 85% of their 5min seed score.
At 100% 5min seed score, they could be as high as ~529.
As per ZWIFT ZRS v3 by VirtuSlo , that means depending on weight, their 5mins pure Watts could be…
55Kg 271W
65Kg 307W
75Kg 342W
etc.
The 85% seed score floor has to be ditched, forum members have been saying it for months, a significant nuber of racers are playing the system to end up at 85% seed score and end up racing in a pen below their true ability.
My own Racing Score is 170, very close to or at my 85% seed score, but the above calculator says my 100% seed score would be 210… Right on the border (or just over) of being able to enter pen E in “range 2” ZwiftHQ races.
@Ryy Things have been very quiet from you guys on forthcoming ZRS developments. Would you be able to give us an update please?
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thanks. i just checked and by the calculator i would be at 323 and my racing score is actually 396.
i dont know, with the previous system i had the feeling that was more competitive but i was also (someting for another post) having more power than today. so thats why i was asking to see if its just my lack of performance or is a mixture of everything
ZRS is built around flat and rolling races. Throw in a longer climb and power becomes decisive factor.
Take my example - my seed is 495 based on the calculator. My score is ~560, but was ~575 after the 2nd Zwift Games stage as my results were quite good - I could use my race craft, punchy power and repeatability to survive in the pack till the finish.
Stages 3/4 (Climb, 450-570) were the exact opposite - I got dropped in the first climb just like you even if I scored PRs in the 5-10 min range. I finished mid-pack or bottom half even if 95% of people above me had lower score than me. That is how ZRS works.
On the other hand, I like that the rolling races are harder than C-races where I was before. It even helped me to finally score a promo to B thanks to zMap, not zFTP.
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i think its even more crucial to spend the extra fuel in the very beginning to stay with the pack otherwise no way. the prob is that for me, at least, its already too much. I see that they have the different ranges. im not sure if this really makes a difference but i will choose the one where im closer to the top of the range…lets see :P.
James Bailey was here for a second regarding ZRS limits for his races. Then he closed the thread with a complaint he will avoid forums again because of ‘comments’. Zwift employees seems to prefer Facebook over their own forums for communication. If they communicate at all.
Long story: They seem to ignore this deliberately as a means of communication. Which shows how much they care for their community, as they also release things like ZRS which shouldn’t have been released as it’s subpar to community developments.
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Totally agree and I feel for you. The problem is that not everyone is a puncher type and can survive the spice start or bumps. What helped me was to focus my training on shorter repeats and over time (years) it made a huge difference.
It is a bit sad that we do not have a roadmap for racing. There was a big expectation last year when they introduced ZRS and “Zwift Labs” club.
I was hoping that they will try and iterate fast on things like points races or elimination races that would give a nice boost to us who like to race and the cost would not need to be that high. It would also improve the Quality of Life for Zwift Racing League. Imagine to see up to date points right on the screen and what it would do to tactics.
We can only wish that the silence means that something is baking and will be announced soon.
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Agree Martin - it’s hilarious to race on ZRS for 5 months on only flat routes then expect the scores to hold up for both a steeper shorter vo2 effort and a 5min climbing effort.
If anyone entering isn’t actively doing typical interval-based training, they will get blown away by people who have.
Depending on your score you could try a range 1 race (270-390) instead of range 2 (330-450). If you’re 390 or above obviously that won’t help. There are always sandbaggers, so it’s always better to focus on having your best race rather than worrying about how strong the other riders are. The same thing happens in ZRL. If you’re looking for more accurate cats, the FRR tour is the best thing I’ve seen on Zwift. However the tour is multiple stages and the rides are long and brutal and make the zwift games look like a cake walk.
Yeah, just did that. Ended almost last but didnt care much. Was a great workout. I gave uo tryong to understand this new ZRS system.
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Have you been putting in some super 5 minute efforts outside of races and group rides.
Based on your ZwiftPower 5 minute information your ZRS looks to be too high.
Could you post what your 90 day 5 minute pb is in watts and date that pb was achieved.
I´ve been done recently mostly group rides, tour de Zwift, this kind of stuff.
my 5 minute best power was 338W in october last year doing a Ramp test.
the 90 days shows 288W based on the first 3 months power curve (not sure where to find the bp exact day in the last 90 days)
this is prob an issue we´ve been discussing, a ramp test is favoring an overestimated FTP as well, as i could push harder for few seconds, but for sure, not sustaining that in a long race.
Thank you. You can find your 5 min 90 day best info on your Zwift.com login profile page. Example:
I suspect the date was when you put in a very hard start climbing The Grade on 2nd March.
Anyway had you started racing on 3rd March I believe your ZRS would be around 275 (323 seed less 15%). As you can see 275 is well below your current score of 387.
Back in October you had a high ZRS (463) and you were possibly at or around your Seed. You have only raced 9 times since and have lost between 3 and 12 points on every race (76 points in those 9 races). You have not been at your floor.
IMO you are probably racing with a ZRS above your current seed. Having a ZRS which doesn’t accurately reflect your current 5 minute power ability will make racing very difficult.
Anyway the good news for you is your most recent drop to ZRS 387 now puts you in Range 1 / 270-390 pen so racing might become just a little easier.
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