Where do I stand against other "C" riders?

Has it changed recently then?

Last I checked cats were based on best 3 W/kg over the past 30 days.

Hey Man with a Plan, there was a very good suggestion that I wanted to make sure did not get lost with all the other dialog.
The Hare and Hound races are really a good option for you.
Each group starts at a different time, (time handicap)
The D’s first then the C then B and A. So starting out, you are only with other C’s.
You will know how you stand against other riders in your category. Of course, as pointed out, there maybe inappropriate riders in the group but you you can’t control that.

Hare and Hounds was my race of choice but they moved the race from Thursday to Wednesday.
They don’t have them daily but they are lots of fun.

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A filter for the riders list would help. Options to show “All Racers” or “Racers in Your Category”. Or click to display “All - A - B - C - D”.

There is a Feature Request for something like this. Hasn’t received a lot of attention.
https://forums.zwift.com/t/filter-riders-list-in-event-by-category/13363

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This can be done on ZwiftHacks - Events

Although native support within Zwift would be good.

DIRT DADurday Chase Race is a similar format.

I agree, Zwift could do a lot more with position data to make racing more enjoyable and making sure people are entering the correct categories.
I started racing in cat D and got promoted to cat C without ever being near the front in any races I entered. As a Cat C I have been able to hang with the front group for a while when entering hare and hounds and similar type races, I’ve even got a 2nd and 3rd place zwiftpower position although there were more riders in my category up ahead so I never felt I was racing for a podium position. racing would be more exciting if category position data was available, and I don’t see the need to rely on a 3rd party website to do what Zwift should be doing itself.

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The “Hare and Hound” sucks. That’s what I need… an “A” rider passing me even though he started 20 minutes after I did. That race was not created for people like us.

Someone please explain, why would a beginner ride in a “Hare and Hound”? That’s like me playing Federer with a 5-0 lead and losing the set. I’d rather lose in an even playing field.

Has anyone from Zwift participated in this thread?

The current system certainly isn’t perfect and multiple people have agreed with that view (why allow an A or B cat rider to enter a C race in the first place, for example), but lots of people have offered different help and guidance which you seem determined to find fault with and reject.

Some races will only show riders in the your category (I don’t know what happens if there aren’t many riders, could get pretty lonely pretty quickly). You can use zwiftpower’s live function in any race to see exactly what you want in realtime (I think).

Re the Hare & Hound races, I’ve only done one of them but it was won by a D cat rider averaging 2.3w/kg, and everyone bar the last 4 riders (from the 42 in the results) finished within 1 minute of each other, which suggests that the concept does work.
https://www.zwiftpower.com/events.php?zid=152016
I guess the obvious downside to this type of race is that if all the C riders are in one group and you get dropped then you’re probably going to get shelled out the back as most likely it’s going to be faster riders that catch up to you next who you also won’t be able to hang with.

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Ricky,

You’re labeling me as the bad seed here because I’m complaining about the app. I have a right to complain because I pay for this.

With that said, I only want to know where I stand with other “C” riders in a race without having to compromise. I don’t care if Geraint Thomas races as a “C” and finishes the race 10 hours before I do. I simply want to see “C” rider Geraint Thomas and his 10-hr lead during the race.

The only decent workaround is what Gerrie wrote: to go to zwiftpower.com, go to the live tab and select to see “C” riders.

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Man, complaining doesn’t make you a bad seed. Neither does wanting to know you position vs the others in your cat. For me it is also a grumble that detracts from the racing - who am I really competing against, do you chase that guy that’s up the road or just ignore him, etc etc.

It also depends whether you’re trying to win the race on Zwift (incl against Geraint Thomas sandbagging as a C rider :wink:), or the race on Zwiftpower (which would exclude GT based on his previous performances). On Gerrie’s screenshot it looks as though of the 7 C riders in the race, only 3 are legit? But then there will be other genuine C riders in the race that aren’t on zwiftpower.

For me, after a couple of races, I stopped paying too much attention to the Zwift results because otherwise you’re competing with 4+ w/kg people when that’s not the cat you entered.

Equally it feels a bit odd when you have a sprint finish with 3 or 4 other people for whatever place it may be, only to check zwiftpower after the event and find that maybe only 1 (or none) of them are on there because not everyone registers for that. I’ll certainly be trying the live tab next time I do a race though.

I also wonder if the “zwifters nearby” in the Companion app would be of any use to show your live position vs all the other riders in the race, not just the 10-12 nearest. Maybe.

In summary… :man_shrugging:

I see your point, and I agree, it would be nice to only see people in your class for the sake of comarison.

That being said, with sandbaggers, weight dopers, mis-calibrated trainers, etc., none of this is accurate in any way. I have done a few races, and inevitably, a few miles in, small groupettos form and I end up racing with a group of similarly paced, similarly zwift-strong riders (whether they are weight doping, riding miscalibrated trainers, whatever…). At that point, I just try to beat the people in my groupetto by the end or choose one or two people to try to beat. Seems a good goal to beat people doing a similar w/kg. Beyond that, who cares where you finished when so many are “cheating”.

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Use the event search app at Zwifthacks. Fully expand the search filters, and look for the filter “see only event category riders”. In those events that populate, only riders in your category will be on the road with you. No more mixing up with multiple categories.

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I agree with the original complaint, and many of the useful replies above, and I think Dan’s is spot on. I used to wish that I would only see other D riders in races. But truth be told, the category is chosen by the rider, and in every race I’ve been in there are “D” riders up the road doing 3-4 w/kg. If I chase them I’m going to blow up. So, instead, I find a group of riders that I can keep with and I see if I can beat them at the end. And then I hope for the best when I go to Zwiftpower … hopefully any of those flyers up the road will have been DQed and I might have a D medal (usually not).

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Just race the rider in front, catch them, race the rider in front etc. until you finish. Check ZwiftPower to see how you did against like-minded riders. Ignore the Zwift app results.

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I made a feature request about this a while back: Filter riders list in event by category

It’s not so much a problem for the A and B category, but it is a bit frustrating for C’s and D’s not knowing where they stand against their competition. This problem could be fixed with a rider list filter or staggering the start of categories at the beginning of a race so riders from a lower category don’t hold on to the wheels of riders in higher categories.

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i_van: They can easily fix this, but they won’t. If you notice, zwift hasn’t even participated in this thread. But that’s besides the point.

On the other hand, Gerrie’s workaround of going to zwiftpower is a good happy medium. I wish it would refresh faster (it refreshes every 20 seconds), but at least I know who I’m racing against.