Race ranking discussion

General Discussion
129

Stopping using categories for racing will alienate the lower categories.

Result based categorisation is what we want to get to ultimately, but this is a good (and well received) first step.

3 Likes
130

Thanks. Genuinely no idea why noone suggested it before. Come on Zwift, do as the man suggests.

2 Likes
131

That is already possible, there is a lot of races that start everyone together, so if that is what you prefer then that is already possible.

1 Like
132

I meant something different.
Instead of fixed limits, you just join a race.
And an algorithm puts you based on your Elo-rating (initially based on the “critical power/FTP” and changed by the race results) in a group with similar riders.
The number of groups are based on the registrations.
For example:
99 riders are split into 3 groups (high, normal, low) of 33 riders.
400 riders are split into 5 groups of (very high, high, normal, low, very low) of 80 riders.

It’s more like dynamic categories.

133

There is a multi-year discussion on what you have proposed. That’s why you were linked to it for “light reading”. You haven’t introduced a new idea to the discussion.

4 Likes
134

@Manuel_Asberger2870

What you just typed was discussed many times in the Tread the James pointed to. In short that is what Zwift is working towards. Have a read it will give you all the information.

This is step one where we are currently.

1 Like
135

.[quote=“James Bailey, post:129, topic:578846, full:true, username:JamesBailey”]
Stopping using categories for racing will alienate the lower categories.

[/quote]
Why do you think so? It didn’t happen on other games. In my opinion dynamic race groups based on previous results encourage weaker riders. Like me :slight_smile:
At the moment you alienate everybody who is just over a cat-limit.

Sorry, but the zwiftpower race-rankings only works for a or b-rider :slight_smile:

136

Stop using categories? I saw this only once.
Then took it as a reminder that Category enforcement isn’t the answer for the cause.

It’s only a light cure for the sandbaggers (symptom).

137

Hi @Manuel_Asberger2870
I think the discussion is better suited for this topic. All about ranking.

138

See e.g. Rankings based matchmaking (get rid of cats!) Give it a vote if you like it.

or just search for “Matchmaking” on the forum.

1 Like
139

Yes. I like it. Except the zwiftpower ranking system. In my opinion the Elo-rating is well approved (chess, sports and most of the video games) and better.

But the thread was from December 2020.
I just want to make sure, that the new category enforcement isn’t the answer.
It’s better than nothing. But still not good.

140

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141

You can start in any cat you want above your minimum - why don’t you do it?

I am not sure you are going to be happy racing against A or A+ riders.

1 Like
142

I think you misunderstand. Instead of using categories you’re using splits.

For example, the minimum split size is 40 riders. When 100 riders register for a race you’ll get 2 splits with 50 riders.

The rider with the highest ELO ranking gets bib number 1, etc. That way you know who you’re racing and your predicted result. If you’re #81 in the ELO ranking of those 100 riders, your bib number will be 31, there are 30 riders in your split with a higher ELO ranking.

Now you’ve a race where 120 riders register. In this example you’re also #81 of those 120 riders. 120 riders means 3 splits with 40 riders. Your bib number? 1. You’re the one to beat.

Since it matters who you’re racing when using ELO ranking you’ve always a goal, namely beating those with a lower bib number.

1 Like