CycleOps Hammer

(Paul) #21

The snapping doesn’t feel to me like the load is disengaging, it sounds more like the chain skipping without feeling much change in load through the pedals.  The next time if happens I am going to try and capture the conditions; gear, power and cadence.  Sorry I don’t have a more definitive description.

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(John Carpenter) #22

I will send Cycleops an email tomorrow. Today the guy riding next to me on his Magnus had his Watts drop to Zero twice on climbs and stalled on the escalator, first time that has ever happened to him. I had the zero watts issue happen to me previously on the Magnus.

I put a new cassette on today versus the mildly used one I had installed initially and used the Shimano spacer (10 speed) instead of the spacer that came with the Hammer, that made a world of difference as I was able to more accurately align the derallieur, eliminate some noise issues and had a great ride experience today, no other problems. I’ve never experienced any snapping, fingers crossed.

 

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(Ed Jenkins 67SEA) #23

The snapping also sounds like a crackle, I changed gears and it went away. My wife wasn’t home as I would have her listen and pinpoint where it is coming from. I will also check the tension on the freewheel retaining fastener tomorrow. 

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(Paul) #24

CycleOps/Saris sent me a response.  First they want me to check the firmware (which is current.)  Otherwise no substantive solution as yet.  I sent a response back to them that the firmware is correct.

On the snapping sound they think  it might be too much grease on the Freehub and sent me a technical bulletin with instructions on how to service it.  Since it is a .pdf I can’t easily copy it here and I don’t have a link to use.

 

 

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(John Carpenter) #25

Did anyone have any resistance issues on Zwift today, neither the Hammer nor Magnus would sink up with the gradients today, it was like we were riding on a completely different road, we tried resetting, rebooting, restarting everything but nothing worked.

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(Brian Chase) #26

Worked as usual for me today.  Still lag and maybe more 0 watt drops on gear changes, but I think I am watching that issue closer lately.

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(Paul) #27

All,

Rob Waters from Saris is working with me on this problem.  His latest request was that I check the status LED’s on the trainer when the problem occurs.  Here is what he requested and he sent me an attachment titled: “CycleOps Hammer & Magnus LED combinations”: 

" Next time there is lag look under your left shoulder at the light on the trainer and see what it is doing, see attached.  Let me know what happens."

The documents is available from Saris.

If anyone else has this problem and can include observations pertinent to the problem you could contact them with your report.

 

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(Brian Chase) #28

Paul,

I just finished 20 miles on Watopia Hilly Route + the Volcano Climb.  I had 7 of the 0 Watt dropout events all on various grade climbs while changing gears to an easier gear.  Light stayed solid white every single time.  I believe Rob thinks it’s an ANT+ connection issue.  I explained to him a few weeks ago that my ANT+ connection was tested by Zwift along with internet and everything checked out with solid connections.

I think it’s a programming issue with Hammer.

I will shoot Rob another email.

Thanks!

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(John Carpenter) #29

I also just finished 20 miles on the Hilly Route along with my co-worker. Before we started we unplugged everything and moved our computers to a position were we could put the ant+ cables within an inch of the trainers. We then recalibrated everything and started the ride. Everything worked perfectly, no lag, no zero watts, resistance matched the road perfectly.

I have no idea if what we did had any impact or it was just coincidental, but it was nice to have a great ride. Lights were white the entire time. Just as a side note, when we both rode on the Magnus I couldn’t keep up with him climbing (just like real life) but on the Hammer I easily drop him. He’s going to get a Tacx Neo any day now.

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(Brian Chase) #30

Here is a picture of a zero watt dropout.  Cadence and HR are still registering so ANT+ is still active.  I was at 650 watts and 16mph when I downshifted one easier cassette gear. I dropped to 5mph after. Hopefully this uploads right!

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(Mark Kidd (C)) #31

Just confirming that this power dropout has happened to me as well. It seems to happen whenever there is a very sudden incease in gradient on Zwift.

Twice in the same race on the Richmond course it happened to me at the bottom of the 23rd street climb, when it goes from a -5% descent to +12% uphill.

I’ll be creating a ticket with Cyclops on this but thought I’d share here (and on DCR comments) to make sure this is more widely known.

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(Ryan Beaver) #32

Having same problem. Opened a ticket with them on Monday. I’ve had little response from them, just to upgrade my firmware and make sure I had the dongle next to the unit(I have it on a cord next to it).

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(John Carpenter) #33

Yesterday I did a 100K on Watopia with no issues, while the Magnus trainer next to me would drop to zero watts on steep incline changes, today both times I went up the escalator watts dropped to zero and the bike stopped for about 2 seconds before I could slowly crawl on up to the top. I’ll open a ticket with CycleOps. I tried to screen shot it but there is too much lag on the Zwift phone app to catch it. I’ll have to set the keyboard close by next time.

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(Caiman Lieu) #34

I rode 75 miles yesterday (Sat) and 65 miles today (Sun) and to my surprise I didn’t experience any power dropout on both days. Of course, the resistance lag was still there as usual. Please note that the power dropout and resistance lag are two different problems so don’t link them together. As noted, I have been using the Hammer since last Dec and I only experienced the power dropout problem recently after applying an firmware update but I believe it is a problem related to Zwift.

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(Mark Kidd (C)) #35

Hi Caimen – you’re right in that the problem of lag seems to be one related to Zwift. It seems to affect a lot of trainers and not just the Hammer - just search Lag on the support hub to see.

 

The problem of dropped power seems to be from the Hammer. This is suggested by Titaniumgeek’s review. Basically when you ease off suddenly then the Hammer under-reports the power. Say if you ease off from 250W to 100W, then the Hammer reports a power trough that you actually went down to 50W. Those power troughs last about 3 seconds.  http://www.titaniumgeek.com/gear-reviews/cycleops-hammer-turbo-trainer-review-zwift-gear-test-titaniumgeek

Maybe it’s possible that some power troughs could be so large as to drop reported power to zero.

 

It seems that the Hammer reports power by calculating resistance x cassette rotation speed. If the cassette rotation drops, then it thinks that you eased off and you get a power trough. I noticed this when getting a power trough on an ERG-mode workout when I was tasked to drop my cadence at the same time as there was a drop in resistance.

 

So when you hit the escalators, what happens is first you bleed speed during the lag while you wait for resistance to pedal against. Then when the resistance kicks in, your cadence drops because it is difficult to push against or you ease gears. Either way the cassette rotation speed drops leading to a power trough. The result is that you lost speed during the lag and then the Hammer reports a power trough of zero power. Inevitably you stop and then you have to wait 3 seconds of pedalling hard before your avatar decides to head off again.

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(John Carpenter) #36

The power drop to zero watts is not just a Hammer issue. It is more pronounced on the Magnus as I watch it happen everyday to the coworker I ride with. So far I’ve not received any feedback from support request other than an automated acknowledgment from CycleOps.

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(Brian Chase) #37

Caiman, I still have another 4-6 weeks of nothing but Zwift (recovering from a cycling accident).  I am thinking about getting the New Kickr2.  Have you had any Kickr2 issues whatsoever on Zwift with lag and/or zero watt drops?  Any other problems or annoyances?  It seems like it might be a perfect match for Zwift but I’d like to make sure.

The Hammer still works overall but it’s really annoying when trying to do races or competitive group rides.  I really wish Cycleops would communicate better and let us know they are working on their issues.  It’s odd that they are so quiet about stuff and it makes me think they might have a hardware issue that is blocking Firmware progress.

Thanks!

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(Ryan Beaver) #38

I will post this in the other thread with a similar subject too: Just got done doing the mountain route after making a change(Magnus user here). Before, when I was getting the drops to 0, on the pairing screen I had the “power source” as the Saris PWR and the “controllable trainer” as Saris FE-C. Today I changed the pairing to make them both Saris FE-C(I couldn’t make them both Saris PWR). Mild success! The 0 power drop outs disappeared but were replaced with the situation above where the power just stays at a fixed level for a few seconds. It still sucks but at least I can ride it for now. Also, out of saddle steep grades like heading to the radio tower are impossible. It won’t hold a wattage. Cycleops is sending a dongle for a firmware upgrade but if this doesn’t fix it they’re sending a new resistance unit. If that still doesn’t do it I’m returning the trainer.

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(Caiman Lieu) #39

 

Brian:

 

My Kickr2 works perfectly in Zwift. It is so responsive to a terrain change that you can actually feel a kick simultaneously with an uptick shown on gradient indicator. This is especially fun riding through rollers with the Hilly Ride option of Watopia, as it kicks in and out so far that it almost feels unnatural. You don’t feel a kick with the Hammer at all, as it smooths its way up a climb but it has an undoubtly slow response, not matching gradient shown on the screen. In fact, if you pay close attention, the Hammer responds so slow that the elevation gain registers long before you feel the resistance change. The elevation gain should register after you feel the resistance going up a hill, as it basically captures what you just did. I truly believe that the Hammer has a slow on-board controller/chipset so it can’t be fixed with a software update. If it was fixable then it would have been done since they worked on their first firmware update for over 2 months after releasing the Hammer late last year. If you look at my comments over DCrainmaker’s blog, Cycleops was active addressing some questions there but they never responded to all the problems with the Hammer that I stated, which means only one thing; they cannot fix the damn thing. Since I don’t race in Zwift so the Hammer is still tolerable for me for now but I can see a clear disadvantage for some of you guys who race aggressively in Zwift with the Hammer.

 

Okay what I don’t like about my Kickr2? It has a very annoying screaming tone which actually made me sick on my first day riding the Kickr2. It was initially sounded like a taking off jet engine. Now the sound has subsided a bit but it still sounds like a table saw. I don’t care how those pro reviewers measure the tone of a trainer with a decibel meter, the actual perceived sound is what counts for us everyday user. The second thing that I don’t like about the Kickr2 is the fake thru-axle that requires an adaptor, which still didn’t fit my bike right, so I had to do some mods to the right side adaptor to make it work.

 

Nowadays, I let my girlfriend use the Kickr2 since her bike has a QR. My bike has a thru-axle so I ride the Hammer most of the time. If they were to release the Kickr3 next week with these two things addressed, then I would put my Hammer on Ebay tonight and then place an order for it immediately.

 

Spring is around the corner so I will be spending most of riding time on the road. I still plan to ride inside throughout the summer though, as I would still want to do a short spin at home on my running and kickboxing days each week.

 

Good luck and have fun folks!

 

-Caiman

 

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(Mark Kidd (C)) #40

So I’ve finally got some responses from CycleOps. It was a matter of just getting hold of the right person there for a full response.

They are working on firmware solutions to both the slow response and to the power drops. They’re confident they’ll be able to solve them but can’t set a date for when they’ll be released.
Based on what they said I feel quite optimistic about this,

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