I haven’t ridden any events, and with extra weight I would surely not ‘improve’ my curve anyway?
You’re not trying to improve your curve or change your Critical Power numbers. Category Enforcement uses raw watts to calculate Critical Power but it still uses w/kg to assign categories. It seems like Zwift recalculates your w/kg each day and it looks like it uses the weight used in your last ride (it doesn’t have to be an event) rather than what you have set in your user profile.
As above, I don’t think it has anything to do with using your new weight to change the CP curve, it’s more along the lines of using your new weight in an activity as a kind of declaration for CE processing, effectively saying “the weight change on zwift.com/zp is correct, use this number instead of my old weight value.”
Simple. Every cat assignment is based on, and every rider is defaulted and set at 75kg and 175cm height. Cats derived from CP and MAP but NOT on a per Kg basis. No ceilings/floors or whatever else attempted formula modifications that take weight into consideration have to be endlessly tweaked and argued over for the next 5 years.
The unit display is w / kg (watt per kg).
‘per kg’ excludes weight from the calculation.
Height is not in the formula.
Speed is calculated from height, weight, watts, etc.
That’s why we can cheat by changing the excluded height and weight settings.
The simplest solution is just to change the formula.
Zero of my comments are aimed at you personally James.
Please don’t take it that way.
I and I’m sure many others greatly value your feedback. In this case there seems a rather large issue has been exposed. Those that race and are hoping for positive steps were simply surprised that this is the case.
I can only hope that both you and others at Zwift see that not addressing this subtle weight manipulation issue within category enforcement itself will cause endless problems.
Zwift cannot expect us, your customers, to self police ourselves.
That is the exact opposite of what is desperately needed.
Why? I’m 62kg and 161cm so clearly that would blow any ability for me to do much out of the water.
Actual LOL
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Top trolling…
Got ya, so you need to have done a race to kick-start the CP calc process (using your new weight). Seems like a relatively easy fix, just don’t apply a category change unless there is a improvement?
I assume there must also be CE updates without doing an event first, for the 60 days aging part.
I thought one of the much-touted advantages of CE was that it used all rides, not just races? So just free ride for 5 mins and the calc will be updated, won’t it? Meaning a downgrade if you bumped your weight up enough. Which would be physically correct if the rider has genuinely gained weight without gaining power. But of course is obviously open to abuse.
Yes, true. Any activity.
not sure it is trolling, i’ve seen it suggested before.
Is it realistic - absolutely not
does it create a fair race - yes if categorised
If all you are interested in is creating a fair categorised race system it could work very well. Obviously the cats would in no way be representative to real life but week to week racing on zwift it would solve a few of the current problems.
Personally I do like the suggestion of not including height. When I am zwifting I am not sitting as aerodynamic as I could but my character and it’s Cda calculations assume I sit very aero. Which is ik that sense not realistic so ignoring height (or having same for everyone) makes sense. Simplifies it quite a bit and then only user input that can’t be measured is weight. Rather than height and weight.
People mentioned here RGT ignores height. Not sure what feedback is on it there ? Think determining Cda just on weight is a good enough proxy and covers the main determinant for Cda (apart from aero position that is already uniform to all).
Oh he’s serious ![]()
Totally absurd and unrealistic suggestion but I take your point that it would group people producing similar watts together.
I do realize that Zwift will not do this. But as you’ve come to realize it would solve pretty much all the problems being discussed. Maybe someday there’d be a way for event organizers to create custom pens that are based purely on wattage.
Nobody wants to give up ideal of pursuing reality, though a bit of a headscratcher in a world with electronic burritos and ghosts, tron bikes and the like.
Meanwhile, these convos will likely carry on indefinitely.
As a race organizer i wonder how to setup CE Races…to start with i have disabled Enforce Zwiftpower Category because that don’t match with CE.
Should i use WKG Enforcement limits? This would prevent someone with no Treshold effort in the last 60days to win a race in a lower category?
No, you’d be grouped with similarly powerful riders. For example, if your current 20min wattage is 186 (3 w/kg), you’d be penned with everybody else that falls in the cat that includes 186 watts – from the 45kg rider who goes at over 4w/kg to the 100kg rider doing 1.9 watts/kg
it doesn’t fundamentally change anything about how a race will play out so it’s about as fair as any other category or ranking system anyone could conceivably come up with, it doesn’t matter how simple or complex it is. you’re just drawing the line in a different place
think practically for a second… what your suggestion will most likely result in is categorising the people with unreasonably strong 1-2min power relative to their ftp (who are also probably well trained in those efforts and will be able to recover from them quickly) against beginners
But we keep getting told sub 2min power uses a different biological system and has no relation to our threshold capabilities at longer durations. ![]()